James’ recent post on making money online got me a little riled up so I thought I would rant a little bit. The only problem is, my rant has no real shape so I’ll probably be all over the map on this one.
First, I have no issues with anything James said, it’s just that the topic of how a beginner can make money online, or how easy it is to make money online brings up a lot of frustration. And that is because a lot of what is said is completely bogus. So this rant is in no way targeted at anything James said in his post, it just got me thinking based on recent experiences.
Now, let me qualify and say that making money online isn’t nuclear physics. Your average person can make money online long before they could learn how to build a nuclear weapon. Einstein-like intelligence is certainly not required even though I have it (okay, maybe I don’t).
I would compare making money online to making money in the stock market. Sure, anybody can do it but many who try it won’t be successful. Many will even lose their shirts (think PPC). Now, if you spend some time studying and understanding the process and options you will be better positioned to make money in either prospect, but there is no guarantee. Why?
Because in both IM and stock investing there are many variables outside of your control. No one can predict the market and no one can predict say, Google’s next algo change. Or, you could buy a stock based on factors (cash flow, P/E, etc) that indicate that stock is a good buy and yet it tanks. Likewise, you may find a niche and what seem to be good keywords based on search volume and CPC, set up a site, and see almost profit. It has happened to me and I have seen many successful IMers admit it has happened to them.
So in both IM and stock investing there is risk and no guarantee of return. Yet most people seem to know that about stock investing but don’t believe that when it comes to IM. I find that kinda funny. But I also find it frustrating because most IMers aren’t pointing out the risks to newbies. Or if they are currently a successful IMer now selling an ebook, they don’t mention that it took them 2 years to turn a profit or that they are a single guy (with no social life) who has spent 14+ hours a day to finally start making money.
And when I say risk in IM, I’m not just talking about losing money. There is also the risk of unrealistic expectations. Maybe you quit your job to try IM full-time. Or maybe you were laid off and don’t get a new job b/c you think you can make it in IM. Yeah, yeah there are risks with active employment but at least with active employment you are paid for your time. I may get a job and be laid off a year later, but at least I was paid for that year.
The reason I need to get this rant out is because over the past almost 2 years I have gotten glimpses of facts that upset me. I have seen someone pushing WSOs on the WF just to see them elsewhere on the forum admit they are not making money. I am CONVINCED that certain “methods” are sold as ebooks because those “methods” no longer work or don’t work that well anymore.
Think about it, if you had a recipe-like method for creating money-generating, simple websites why the heck would you sell it and create competition for yourself? Even worse, why would you sell a good “method” to the masses knowing that the IM locusts will swarm and make your “method” useless and obsolete. And that is not to say that some of the methods that have been popular don’t work but they never seem to work as well as the ebook says (I have a few products in mind) or they quickly fizzle out.
Another big problem I have in my online forays is that many people just show their earnings and not their net revenue. Newbies or the less successful IMers get all starry-eyed over the people making money, but how much money did they have to spend on content and what-not to get there? How much money do they still spend to maintain their income?
If you read around more on blogs and forums I think it is safe to safe that most people aren’t making good money online. Maybe they are lazy, but many are not. I just don’t think it is that easy. Making money (primarily through websites) takes time and effort. I would say for 90% of people who start today, it will take you a year or two at least to make a living passive income. If you need immediate money you need to provide a service or something and that is not easy either.
Anyway, I could probably rant for another 800 words but this is enough to make me feel a little bit better. I just have happened to come across too many things lately that really start to frustrate me. But correcting misperceptions isn’t going to be making ME any money so this is where I will stop and focus on my own house.
Disclaimer: Some may call me a pessimist but I consider myself a realist. Prove to me that the majority of IMers are successfully make money after one year and I’ll change my perspective.
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24 Responses to Making Money Online Isn’t That Easy
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I understand where you’re coming from. Especially the point about people who aren’t making money yet selling eBooks. And don’t get me started on the people that make ALL their money selling products to Newbies about methods they actually don’t even profit from themselves…
I often go through phases where I think I’ve wasted so much time, I’m not getting anywhere etc. But when I take a look at what I’m actually doing each day, I often find a reason why it’s going wrong. Obviously I haven’t rectified everything otherwise the earnings I just put up on my blog would be a lot higher
And you’re right about people not telling you that you actually need the experience to know what you’re doing right or wrong, what to focus on more and what to let go. It takes more than a step by step system unfortunately. Everyone is different, and I do think luck (and spending money on your business) plays a role too. Not to mention the passage of time.
Hmm my reply really isn’t that focused, but I will say I know where you’re coming from! But the more time I “waste” i.e. the more time I spend earning a pittance from my sites even when I work hard, the more I really am determined I’m going to make it work! I guess this is the point where you (not you personally) either decide it will work and carry on, or give up on it entirely.
Ruth – Web Career Girl recently posted..August Earnings- My Passive Income Progression and Update
Yeah Ruth, I’m not willing to throw in the towel yet either even though I am far from where I would like to be. Everything I have done was at least a learning experience.
I think another reason I get upset about some of this stuff is the ebooks, the backlink packets, etc can eventually ruin things for everyone. Not that you can really blame anyone completely, but imagine how many techniques could still work if they hadn’t been swarmed by people being told they can make an easy buck.
Carrie recently posted..August Update – Getting Ready
Great post Carrie – something probably everyone new to this business should read (I’m linking to it on my blog!). I totally agree that it takes most a year or more to make any decent income in this business – and usually a lot longer. I also agree a lot of gurus and WSO offers contribute to unreasonable expectations in this business.
However, I also think a lot of people are looking to earn money quickly and with little effort, so they are easy targets, so to speak. But a good dose of reality is what a lot of people need, and hopefully blogs like yours can help toward this effort.
Michelle recently posted..Weekly Update 13 August 25-31
Thanks Michelle.
And you are right, many people are looking to earn money quickly. And we all know that one piece of advice in IM for a profitable niche is desperation of the target.
So you end up with a lot of IMers taking advantage of wanna be IMers. The problem is, I think, that there is some collateral damage for the rest of us.
Carrie recently posted..August Update – Getting Ready
Yeah I definitely agree with Michelle too about some people being easy targets – it’s hard to know who’s to blame really but I think even those who are willing to work hard get blinded and misled by the gurus sometimes.
As for the backlink packets etc – you are so right! And that’s what makes me wonder, too, about why these people give away their methods on how they make money. Surely they’ll ruin their long term earnings potential? I guess it either comes down to the fact that they never give it all away, or that chance and time and different people’s strengths do have a much bigger impact than some might think.
Ruth – Web Career Girl recently posted..August Earnings- My Passive Income Progression and Update
I’m still reading the post – Michelle told me to! – thanks for the mention, though you skeeered me on my blog when you mentioned a rant.
I just read Daniel T.’s “Ra.nk M.over” again…
Hmmm…
I think he should read this post. In it he mentions a method that no doubt works, but “interestingly” mentions his buddies’ services…
I was left feeling that, “Crap. I can’t win at this…”
I don’t have the money for all the services – which is what I was trying to rally against in my post.
I’ll have a follow up to that post…though I see I repeated myself in the conversation to “Janet”…so will need to do some heavy editing.
One email from an IMer launching yet another “necessary” product my way just really … really got up my nose.
It dovetails into the current dialog I think.
JamestheJust on Elance recently posted..Make Money Online And Don’t Pay A Dime – Newbie Orientation
I just finished your post.
A couple of thoughts: yes, there are a lot more factors to consider than mere CPC or search volume…
Like “buying” keywords and “trends” etc. – very true, and a good point.
The methods in ebooks, though – I’ve only read 2 plus a few “reports” – have all worked for me.
(XFactor and Amazon…OK – still working on Amazonian Profit Plan, timing sucks still for me…)
So I disagree with you on that point (not because I want you to buy from me, either, but please do…)
I would agree with you on the cost vs. expense deal, though – and the fact that getting a job ain’t such a horrid idea if the timing’s right…
And wanted to say: don’t get down on yourself. I honestly think you got the mustard in one hand and the ketchup in the other.
I think MY problem is focus time…and dedication to ONE thing. Hard to do with client work.
JamestheJust on Elance recently posted..Make Money Online And Don’t Pay A Dime – Newbie Orientation
James,
I said “And that is not to say that some of the methods that have been popular don’t work but they never seem to work as well as the ebook says”. I don’t think anyone could ever get the figures that Google Sniper threw around and I also have heard people complain about the earning expectations of Xfactor.
So I am not saying the methods don’t work, but they don’t usually live up to the hype.
I honestly think you got the mustard in one hand and the ketchup in the other
Who moved my hotdog??!!
Too true. And yes: not easy!
JamestheJust on Elance recently posted..Make Money Online And Don’t Pay A Dime – Newbie Orientation
Carrie,
Preach it! Feel free to rant. I wish you had kept going for 800 or 2000 more words. You are 100% correct in everything you say. Most don’t realize the amount of time and effort that goes into what you do.
I think there are a lot of IMers trying to sell products to the wanna-be IMers. That is a complaint of all the real estate gurus; they make their money selling books not in real estate.
If I ever came up with a fool proof system for making money, there is no way I would publish it. I would share with my family and create a dynasty like the Rockefellers, not sell it in an ebook.
Finally, I agree that you are a realist and not a pessimist. I think we are cut from the same mold.
kidgas recently posted..August Is Best AdSense Month for 2010
Thanks Kidgas, I’m glad someone understands my realism
Re: Kidgas – not me.
I’d actually make it into an info product – then you’d make the Rockefella’s jealous.
Just because it’s an e-book doesn’t make it scammy – you just need to know who to trust.
The John XFactor book taught me tons – I didn’t know how to set up a site, nothing – his videos were a GREAT newbie orientation, to tell the truth…
I dunno. I have a different perspective on that note, not trying to knock your opinion – I have the same reservations about the endless parade of new and shiny objects…
And just wrote a Hub about that entitled, “What are the basics of SEO?”
Which is titled that way because another Hubber asked it…not because I’m a pro.
Anyway: I don’t think it’s as hard to make money online as it’s being made out to be.
No offense to you or Carrie, I respect both of you – I’ve had a pretty profitable venture so far, only not enough time in the day to balance passive with active income.
I think because I did learn my SEO and IM stuff from these ebooks (2 of them), I’m more prone to say they’re not so bad.
Implementing them is another issue.
JamestheJust on Elance recently posted..Make Money Online And Don’t Spend A Dime Part 2
James,
I did say “making money online isn’t nuclear physics”. I’m just saying that it is not as easy as someone trying to sell you an ebook would like you to believe.
For most people (maybe you are one of the lucky 20%) it takes time and consistent effort. Or money to invest to ramp things up. Yes, some people do well very quickly, but I would say that is the exception and not the norm.
And I’m not talking $500/mo in 3 months time, I said “for 90% of people who start today, it will take you a year or two at least to make a living passive income”. Maybe I just live in a more expensive area of the country.
Or maybe I am just frequenting the wrong blogs but I’m pretty sure some of your IM heros took at least a year to see a decent income. Not entirely sure though.
You are obviously free to disagree with me, I just think you misunderstood some of what I said.
ITA with that – but maybe I’m just confusing what your and Kidgas’ points were.
Clarifying your point that way, I don’t disagree – and I’m not making the kind of money that I can write home about.
I make most from Elance gigs.
This month it’s $600 passive for me, thereabouts. Not bad but not a living (it’s also not all in hand, either – various programs are at different schedules).
I should probably re-read your rant…
Accept this olive branch. I misinterpreted your point.
JamestheJust on Elance recently posted..Make Money Online And Don’t Spend A Dime Part 2
Hi Carrie, I have not as yet read through the comments on your post, but will go back and do that. I am in full agreement with you and am also in full realization as to your frustrations. This IM stuff is very far from easy, albeit, as you said, it can be learned, as one would when working the stock market.
I quote you here… “But I also find it frustrating because most IMers aren’t pointing out the risks to newbies. Or if they are currently a successful IMer now selling an ebook, they don’t mention that it took them 2 years to turn a profit or that they are a single guy (with no social life) who has spent 14+ hours a day to finally start making money”.
Hmmm… funny, cos I’m that guy – the one who works hard and lacks something of a social life. But then too much of that inevitably causes burn-out so you have to find more of a happy medium. But one thing I do in many of my blog posts and also when I was writing up my WF 40 day challenge was to make it clear that this IM stuff is not a quick fix and it does take time and a hellish amount of effort.
Even if you have some fairly serious money to invest in all the “right” tools and the “right” info products, the facts are still that you can make a right mess up. I did just that! Its taken me about 18 months to actually see any regular monthly profits and the amount of money and time I’ve wasted during that first 18 months is pretty shocking. I think if my friends and family knew the truth of it, they would shake their heads in disbelief, actually.
However, that first 18 months has provided me with strength of knowledge and hard earned experience, and I am now forging ahead using that as my foundation. Without that, I’d be making far more errors now than I actually do, so you can see that initial 18 months as “time well spent”, as odd as that may seem when I look back at the incredible frustrations and roller coaster ride depressions I went through to get to where I am now.
You yourself remember how we first “met” about 8 months ago on the WF when I was offering to write articles for 5 or 6 bucks a piece. I needed to do that to supplement my IM income, but doing such a thing at such a price and you’re sure to be working 14 hour days, 7 days a week also. A sure fire way to burn out.
Anyways, once I’ve read the comments here, I’ll pop over to James blog and have a read up of his post.
Just to re-iterate, this IM stuff is a very tough cookie to crack, so I’m totally with you on that!
Hope all is going well with you and the new house is a dream!
Joseph
Regards to folks giving away their IM “secrets”. I suspect there are a variety of reasons for doing that, some of which are not so “user friendly”. But take Michelle for example. She’s just written up a 4 week blog account of how she goes about setting up for profiteering from a Clickbank product, and she knows how to profit from CB cos she is a real pro at it and it shows in her monthly income figures she knows her stuff.
Why would she tell others her “secrets”? I don’t know for sure, but maybe its to build her brand. What say you Michelle? All I do know for sure is that its a super account of how to do this IM stuff incredibly well!
When I did my Warrior Forum “thing” I did it both for selfless and selfish reasons. The selfish reasons were to give myself a boot in the rear end and really get going with my own SEO and IM business cos I was in a rut. I had to find a way out of that rut, and the way I chose was to enter into the limelight for a while and “tell all”. It worked – I am now no longer in the rut. And I trust that many folks gained quite a lot out of me sharing my own “secrets” as to how to rank pages in Google etc.
I personally still feel that making money online is not easy – not at the start at least. I remember reading the interview that James did with Daniel Tan, and Daniel said something along the lines of when-ever he purchased a “glossy guru” info product they seemed to work for him and he was able to implement that info to make profits. And that kinda got to me cos I’m very much the opposite – very few of the glossies worked for me, regardless they cost me a small fortune. But Daniel must be one of the 20% and me – I’m one of the other 80%. So be it.
We’ve all got to find our own way in IM and that takes time. What works for one person will not work nearly so well for another – that’s what I’ve found.
What Ruth says, and I quote…
“But the more time I “waste” i.e. the more time I spend earning a pittance from my sites even when I work hard, the more I really am determined I’m going to make it work! I guess this is the point where you (not you personally) either decide it will work and carry on, or give up on it entirely”…
…well, for me, this is the true difference between ultimate success and ultimate failure. If you keep on plodding along even though you are still only making a pittance, then you are almost inevitably going to be the winner at the IM game! And ignore all those emails that you get declaring such things as making 10k US in 4 months. Just knuckle down and do your thing and follow along with only those folks you really trust to be telling you “how it is”.
Joseph Archibald recently posted..Income Stats From My Internet Marketing August 2010
Thanks for your comments, Joseph.
Just one response to your comment about Michelle – she’s not selling her info. And she is transparent with her earnings, time, costs, etc.
I don’t have a problem with people sharing free info like she does, it’s the chronic ebook sellers that make me suspicious.
Carrie recently posted..August Earnings Posted
Great post! I agree 110%
I have been working on a site now for nearly 2 years, and I could make more money searching the walmart parking for loose change that my site makes. My time is really limited, so I know it’s going to take me more time than most, but I know eventually, the hard work will pay off.
I have followed many blogs in the last 2 years of people trying to make a passive income on the internet – and probably about 90% of those blogs have gone inactive, or the domain has expired. It’s not easy, but it can be done with persistence and hard work. I cringe when I see those late night infomercials, or hear the radio commercials that tell you how easy it is to make money on the internet, and how you can just sign up and watch the money roll in. Yeah… right. If only. If it was that easy, everyone would do it, and we would all be millionaires.
Gil recently posted..July Review
Thanks Gil.
Carrie recently posted..Google Revises Search Data
Gil – That makes me feel kind of good actually, that 90% of the blogs just went dead. I am glad that some of us are persevering still – and we will see success eventually
Ruth – Web Career Girl recently posted..From Now On My Plan Is… To Focus My New IM Strategy
I think Internet marketing is easy once you “get it,” but it’s hard until you get there.
The key is learning to recognize what a good niche and good keywords are. And then even with good keywords, you have to learn how much “push” they need to get to page one.
You can read all the books that you want, but you aren’t going to really learn it until you do it, you have to absorb it. And that is where everyone’s learning curve is going to be different.
Some people may have a good mentor to guide them and speed up the process. Some people may be better at recognizing what direction success is in. But most people give up before they realize the success they were expecting.
I’ve learned a lot from different people, but I take it all into consideration and develop my own system and own method.
The other thing is that what works for one niche may not work for another. The best thing that has worked for my sites is just looking at the top three sites for my keywords, deconstructing their backlink profile, and then beat them at their own game.
As for the backlink and niche packs, I bought backlink packets when I was learning. It showed me the types of sites to look for, where and how to place the links, and now I find my own.
I look at niche packs as examples of how to set things up and what to look for. Because if someone is selling a list of keyword ideas to multiple people, you automatically know those keywords are now going to be hard to get because every single buyer is going to be going after them. They are training, not plum keywords and niches.
If you want to ensure your success, you need to learn to identify buyer keywords that you have a chance to get to #1 on, and then just write content and build backlinks until you get there.
JOYCE WINS!!!
Great, sage (and thyme, and oregano) advice. Worthy of a Paypal payment.
(( now…why don’t you have a blog?? ))
Alright. Just wanted to crown Joyce the freaking winner here – that was an awesome comment!
JamestheJust on Elance recently posted..Copywriting Tips That Will Make You A Million Bucks
Thanks Joyce, that is good advice.
I guess it depends on how one defines “easy”. Getting to the learning point you talk of takes time, hard work, and some cash output.
Carrie recently posted..Google Revises Search Data